Separation March 04, 2013

The First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States guarantees freedom of religion, its exercise, and the freedom of speech.

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Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

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As Jefferson defined it in a letter to the Danbury Baptist Association in Danbury Connecticut:

To messers. Nehemiah Dodge, Ephraim Robbins, & Stephen S. Nelson, a committee of the Danbury Baptist association in the state of Connecticut.

Gentlemen

The affectionate sentiments of esteem and approbation which you are so good as to express towards me, on behalf of the Danbury Baptist association, give me the highest satisfaction. my duties dictate a faithful and zealous pursuit of the interests of my constituents, & in proportion as they are persuaded of my fidelity to those duties, the discharge of them becomes more and more pleasing.

Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should “make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,” thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.

I reciprocate your kind prayers for the protection & blessing of the common father and creator of man, and tender you for yourselves & your religious association, assurances of my high respect & esteem.

Th Jefferson

Jan. 1. 1802.

constitutions,government,events,history,John Hancock,laws,legal documents,men,people,rights,rules,signings,statesmen,United States

Thomas Jefferson was among those who put together our constitution. James Madison kept him up-to-date on the goings on back at home during Thomas’s trip abroad. If anyone knows what something means within the Constitution, it’s Jefferson.

From its inception, the Constitution was under constant barrage by overzealous Christians who felt that the Constitution was not of God. It does not mention God even once. Christians from the beginning felt that this nation should be Christian and have never been happy with how things turned out. They do not realize that it was made purposely secular, purposely neutral, where religion is concerned. The reason it was done this way is simple: A number of the founding fathers had just left England and its oppressive state-sponsored religion. They didn’t want to end up with the same thing they had just left.

What the Religious Right, a loosely connected group of highly conservative Christian Sects, does not understand is that if not for the Separation of Church and State, and the wall of protection it affords, their numbers would not be as great as they are today. The Separation of Church and State has provided the conditions under which Christianity, as well as the huge number of its variations, as well as others, have flourished.

If one large sect of Christianity, or for that matter, of any religion, had become the state’s religion, all other minority religions would have been harassed at best, crushed out of existence at worst.

Why then do they continue? Are they stupid?

To be honest, just as in the population in general, some are stupid, some are ignorant, and some are devious.

If anyone remarks to you that this is supposed to be a Christian Nation and that there is no wall of separation between Church and State, you can be sure they do not have the best intentions in mind. These people mean to force their beliefs on the masses.

Christianity in America is not suppressed in any way, neither are other religions to the extent that they do not interfere with other belief systems. The only reason anyone would want to destroy the Wall of Separation between Church and State is to dominate the country. That is what many Dominionists desire.

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9 Responses to Separation March 04, 2013

  1. john zande says:

    Great post. I’m a huge fan of your Mr. Jefferson; an astonishing mind. It seems, however, that evangelicals have a terrible time understanding the meaning of the word, “secularism.”

  2. drenn1077 says:

    To many fundamentalists the term “secularism” means anti-theism, or atheism. This of course, as you know, could not be further from the truth. Secularism to me means a neutral stance, taking no sides. Then again, the theists have always maintained that if you are not for them, you are against them. It fits well with their black-and-white with no grays outlook.

  3. john zande says:

    It really stumps fundamentalists when you point out to them you don’t need to be an atheist to be a secularist.

  4. Good blog! I’m also finding out in debates with fundamentalists that they don’t make the distinction, when it comes to the founders, that a belief in God did not always equate with a belief in the Deity of Jesus. Jefferson and Franklin were obviously not Christians. They were Deists.

    Christians believe they’ve got a ringer when it comes to Washington. But the things they present as ‘proof’ that he was Christian are not convincing. Even though Washington advises, in an address to an Indian council, to follow the religion of Jesus Christ, this only tells me (as Franklin had also stated) that he felt the teaching was good for improving one’s self and for the virtue of society — or something of that nature. It does not tell me that Washington believed Jesus died for him personally or rose again or saved his soul from going to Hell or even believed others would go to Hell because they didn’t believe Jesus was God’ son and all that entails. (Of course, the definition of ‘virtuous’ is left in the eye of the beholder, lol! I think American Indians and African slaves had a difference of opinion on what society considered virtuous.)

    Another argument Christians will present about Washington is a letter a relative wrote ‘assuring’ the addressee that Washington was indeed a Christian because he attended church with her and Grandma witnessed him taking communion. Duh! Of course one who personally believed they were a Christian would also tell ANYONE such an esteemed relative was also a Christian — especially back in those days! I don’t think Grandma was into critical thinking at that time either, lol!

    Many Deist attend church today as they did back in colonial America. That doesn’t make them a Christian as it is defined by the fundamentalist/evangelicals. I think they count on many of us not to understand their definition.

    It is so, soo-o-oo-o clear to me the original intent was a neutral stance when it came to church/state relation. But, those of us who think like this are up against people who think history has been re-written somewhere along the way, lol!

  5. messaoud says:

    hello every one I am glade to tell you that I am seriouse about your topics but I ask you a question and put it in your minds until the djadjment day do you really know something
    about what’s get me happy and proud of my self :
    you said i am not intrested in hapines are you what “!!” that’s what i am talking about people today want to be happy enough you think that you did well just think about it how many people are die because of some stupid minds who say this people do not deserve life why all of this
    why you don’t put money to help hungere people and you that’s not humanity humanity is to don’t let a human sleep hungre and you eat too much and let other people worship a human instead of god or worship a prophet like mouses or jesus or muhmmed that’s a big mistake what we have to do really is to worship god only because he is the creator and he is the one who love poor people and ask you humanity to be as good as possible with poor people because if you give god gives you more then you give if you want him to help you he will help you as much as you could imagine if you pray to him when people go to sleep and some goes to there wife be cause god said that he came to the sky every night and asks people is every one ask me so i give him is every one worship me so i put him into paradise .
    but people don’t get and said you are terorists and you are bad this people don’t you ro know the truth which i found trouaght islam so let me ask you a question and you could leave
    who pray 5 times a day and happy and go to pray at 4 am wherase others drink until 4 the morning are they muslims who gives 2.5% of there wealth to poor people each year are not muslims think about it and read the quran “the book wich has no mistake (i chalenge you to pick up one mistake)” and you will see truelly why I am very happy do not be afraid of me we are here to be open mind not to kill people as the west think we are last word you’ll deside yourself if you wanna know the truth tank you and peace be open you I didn’t said it in the begining but one more time islam means peace so peace be open you

  6. john zande says:

    “i chalenge you to pick up one mistake”

    Easy. Sura Al-Furqan 25:61 states god revealed to Muhummad that the moon reflected the suns light. This has been interpreted as scientifically miraculous (Dr. Zakir Naik).

    Well, it’s dead wrong. Anaxagoras first figured out the moon reflected the suns light ONE THOUSAND YEARS before Mohammad.

  7. drenn1077 says:

    There are many words that apply to Islam, but peace is not one of them. That is, unless you mean the peace that prevails after Islam has conquered everyone and oppressed them into acceptance of Islam. When the numbers of those adhering to Islam reach a point where they feel they can assert Islamic law, then that is what happens. Like all religions, when the religion becomes the belief of the majority, that religion seeks power. Power to make everyone obey their edicts.
    The Bible is riddled with contradictions, lies, and horrors. Since Islam is an outgrowth of Christianity, a fact that cannot be denied, Islam is just as flawed.

  8. john zande says:

    Thanks for this link, Drenn! Just what i’ve ben looking for!

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